ask a Pentecostal

Continuation of previous post

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry_joseph

2. Pentecostals did not believe in Confession. Believes in praying to God directly for forgiveness of Sin.

We believe that they should be confessed to God directly in prayer because he is the one who forgives sin. We are told in Holy Scripture "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9). We believe that when we have harmed others, we should make confession both to God in prayer and to the person or people wronged.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry_joseph

Why Jesus give authority to his disciples to forgive sin?.

This is an authority given to the entire church. All believers have this authority. Part of this authority relates to church discipline. Another part of this authority relates to the prayers of believers as they relate to the remission of the temporal consequences of sin. James 5:13-20,

And the prayer of faith will save the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working. . . . My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

Sin not only has spiritual and eternal consequences. It has temporal ones as well. It is in relation to the temporal effects of sin that Jesus gave the church the power to forgive or to withhold forgiveness. Through intercession, believer's can forgive, pardon, and remit the full effects and consequences of sin, so that those who deserve to reap corruption by their actions (Galatians 6:8) would not. This is for the purpose of loosing people from the captivity and bondange that Satan wants to hold them in until they have time to awaken and repent. This is temporary and is dependent on the intercession and spiritual warfare of believers.

There is a point, however, when intercession on behalf of people is no longer in their best interest. There comes a time when people need to feel the consequences of their sins. In these cases, we have power to withhold forgiveness and withdraw our intercession, even to deliver them up to Satan for the destruction of the flesh in the hope that the spirit might be saved (1 Corinthians 5:5). It is the church's responsibility to discipline unrepentant believers through both informal and formal methods with the goal of restoration in mind.

There was a member of my church who fell into serious immorality. At a Sunday night service, a visiting pastor who knew our church well preached on 1 Corinthians 5. In response, we all gathered around the altar and began to pray in concert. We did as Paul instructed the Corinthians to do to the immoral brother among them. We prayed that the hedge of protection might be lifted and that this man might know the full consequences of his sin and that he be delivered over to Satan for a time so that his spirit might be saved. (As an aside, that man did repent and is still in church, but it took him hitting rock bottom and losing almost everything for his eyes to be open).

I say that to say the following: Pentecostals see John 20:23 and other verses like it as applying to all of God's people, the priesthood of all believers, the church. And there are examples in church history where other Christians have operated in similar functions. There is a documented history of lay confession in both the East and the West (The New Catholic Encyclopedia has an entire article on Lay Confession). It is also documented that at various times and places martyrs and confessors were believed to have the power to pardon sin (Hippolytus, Apostolic Tradition 9.1). We see this in Eusebius' Church History Book 5, chapters 1-2 where the Gallic martyrs restored apostates back to the church through their intercession:

45. “But the intervening time was not wasted nor fruitless to them; for by their patience the measureless compassion of Christ was manifested. For through their continued life the dead were made alive, and the witnesses showed favor to those who had failed to witness. And the virgin mother had much joy in receiving alive those whom she had brought forth as dead.
46. For through their influence many who had denied were restored, and re-begotten, and rekindled with life, and learned to confess. And being made alive and strengthened, they went to the judgment seat to be again interrogated by the governor; God, who desires not the death of the sinner, but mercifully invites to repentance, treating them with kindness.

. . . . . . . .

5. A little further on they say: “They humbled themselves under the mighty hand, by which they are now greatly exalted. They defended all, but accused none. They absolved all, but bound none. And they prayed for those who had inflicted cruelties upon them . . .
6. And again after mentioning other matters, they say:
“For, through the genuineness of their love, their greatest contest with him was that the Beast, being choked, might cast out alive those whom he supposed he had swallowed. For they did not boast over the fallen, but helped them in their need with those things in which they themselves abounded, having the compassion of a mother, and shedding many tears on their account before the Father.
7. They asked for life, and he gave it to them, and they shared it with their neighbors. Victorious over everything, they departed to God. Having always loved peace, and having commended peace to us they went in peace to God, leaving no sorrow to their mother, nor division or strife to the brethren, but joy and peace and concord and love.” . . .

ltwin · #**377** Yesterday, 10:53 am

Quote:

Originally Posted by benjohnson

Yes... but it's rare. We tend to seek scientific or medial reasons first for abhorrent behavior.

Pentecostals believe also that there scientific and medical causes for some behaviors. However, we also keep in mind that even medical situations could be driven by an underlying diabolical agent.

Quote:

Originally Posted by benjohnson

From http://xrysostom.blogspot.com/2006/08/exorcism.html

"One thing anyone thinking of performing an exorcism must keep in mind is that it isn’t a personal battle between evil spirit and holy person. The conflict is between God and the demon and the exorcist is only Christ’s instrument of speaking His Word and offering prayers. To issue a personal challenge to a malignant demon could result in what happened to the sons of Sceva (Acts 19:11-20) or worse.

Classical Pentecostals are weary of any long winded or elaborate exorcisms. Obviously, the Roman Rite of Exorcism is too wordy and extravagant for our tastes. But we also criticize some charismatics, neo-charismatics, and others who create elaborate demonologies and insist on interrogating demons and knowing the demon's "name" so as to assert control and dominion over it. Classical Pentecostals believe exorcisms should be quick, simple, and authoritative---namely, command the demon to leave in the name of Jesus. Everything else is unnecessary. Of course, this is why only very spiritually devout people (usually ordained ministers) who pray and fast on a regular basis are encouraged to work in deliverance ministries.

Quote:

Originally Posted by benjohnson

What I found interesting from a Lutheran standpoint is a realization that we don't perform many exorcisms is perhaps playing into Satan's seduction of modern man.

"The paucity of possessions in these days may be because Satan works better by keeping attention away from the supernatural and instead focusing people’s attention on the “ordinary” world and “scientific” explanations for everything. Perhaps he fears that if he draws attention to himself and the realm of the demonic, people will be more likely to seek help from God rather than from science and medicine. Since “Satan disguises himself as an angel of light, (2 Corinthians 11:14)” he appears to prefer seducing people to his side over terrifying them — especially if the terror shakes them out of a spiritual slumber."

What I worry about are self-professed Christians who don't believe in the demonic at all.

ltwin · #**378** Yesterday, 12:52 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry_joseph

We catholics belive that Eucharist is body of Christ. As you pentecostals deny the presence of jesus in Eucharist and not accept that it is body of christ , then how will you explain this verse?. Is it against your faith?....

I already responded to this in post 375 page 25. But I wanted to give you more writings from Pentecostals over the years that touch on this question. D.W. Kerr, “The Message of the Sacrament.” The Weekly Evangel (28 October 1916), p. 4:

Faith can grasp mysteries that are unexplainable. Faith enters into a realm far beyond the sphere of understanding, and can extract the good and joy out of what soars high above our reasonings. We have no need to preach a doctrine of consubstantiation nor of transubstantiation; we just receive Jesus ’words and act on them. "Whoso eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life."

William A. Cox, “The Spiritual Import of the Lord’s Supper.” The Weekly Evangel (May 4, 1918), p. 8:

It (the Lord’s Supper) is not an empty service, it does not mean simply being served with a little bread and wine on the first Sunday of the month— it is a means of fellowship with God, through Jesus, by the Spirit, and we have a right to come to it expecting God to meet us. Indeed we have a right to expect to draw so near to God that whatever our need may be at that moment, whether spiritual or physical, He will supply it. . . . when we eat of the divine body of the Lord Jesus, the living Bread which came down from heaven. . . He quickens the spiritual man; He revives the physical; He heals our diseases, and gives us strength to live by. By eating Jesus, the Bread of life, we have life in our physical bodies. . . . if we eat the flesh of Jesus, and drink His blood, we shall live by Him. So when you want to be healed, just take a great big meal of Jesus.

Cecil B. Knight, “Communion: A Sign and a Seal.” Church of God Evangel (22 March 1971), p. 16-17:

There is deep spiritual meaning in the Lord’s Supper. The participant does not merely look at the symbols; he receives spiritual food. Just as the bread and the fruit of the vine will nourish and invigorate the body of man, so Christ, through Communion, sustains and quickens the soul. When a Christian truly worships Christ in the Lord’s Supper, he is ministered to by the Holy Spirit, thereby receiving strength and a deep abiding peace.

J. Roswell Flower, “The Lord’s Supper.” Word and Witness (August 1915), p. 5:

The Lord Jesus is brought very near in the observance of the Lord’s Supper. The redemptive work for the body is often attested to, as the communicants partake in faith, drinking His blood, and eating His flesh, the Lord healing them of sicknesses and delivering them of infirmities. Praise His precious name forever.

journey00 · #**379** Yesterday, 2:26 pm

Hi Itwin!! I think this is a great idea, thanks for starting this! I have questions:

1. This is going to be a lot of work, are you responding to all these questions by yourself?

2. I see you had over a 1,000 posts before you began this neat thread. What events lead you to be part of a Catholic forum?

3. Did you join thinking you may find holes in Catholicism, thus disproving Catholicism?

4. Do Pentecostals believe that Catholics are Christian?

Thanks in advance for your answers and taking the time..

4Squarebaby · #**380** Yesterday, 2:57 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by journey00

Hi Itwin!! I think this is a great idea, thanks for starting this! I have questions:

1. This is going to be a lot of work, are you responding to all these questions by yourself?

2. I see you had over a 1,000 posts before you began this neat thread. What events lead you to be part of a Catholic forum?

3. Did you join thinking you may find holes in Catholicism, thus disproving Catholicism?

4. Do Pentecostals believe that Catholics are Christian?

Thanks in advance for your answers and taking the time..

If you don't mind since I have 1000 post and posted twice to the thread. However I don't debate theology and when challenged by the masses I can just walk away.
2. I was getting married in what the Catholic _hurch calls a mixed marriage.
4. Evangelic's and Pentecostals in particular would think that some Catholics are Christians. Being a member of a church by itself would not do it.

journey00 · #**381** Yesterday, 3:24 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Squarebaby

If you don't mind since I have 1000 post and posted twice to the thread. However I don't debate theology and when challenged by the masses I can just walk away.
2. I was getting married in what the Catholic _hurch calls a mixed marriage.
4. Evangelic's and Pentecostals in particular would think that some Catholics are Christians. Being a member of a church by itself would not do it.

No, 4Squarebaby, I don't mind at all you answering also! That's cool with me.

On your response of #4:

I agree with you, being a member of a church by itsef would not make you a Christian. Just because someone is a member of an Assembly of God or (insert other church) doesn't necessarily make him/her a Christian. You must act & behave like a Christian to be a true Christian. Walk the walk, not just talk the talk, right? lol. Let me re-phrase, do Pentecostals consider a moral, Holy-Trinity believing, Jesus is the Son of God Catholic a Christian or non-Christian? The reason I'm asking is because I've been told that some Pentecostals don't think that Catholics are Christians. I hope I'm expressing myself correctly. Thanks!

lance4648 · #**382** Yesterday, 3:46 pm

I hope you don't mind me responding. Personally, I consider anyone who loves God with all their heart and soul to be a Christian regardless if they go to an Assemblies of God or Catholic church. I also believe all churches are full of people who are going thru the motions.
A good indicator is how someone behaves out in the real world when a priest, pastor or church congregation isn't watching.

journey00 · #**383** Yesterday, 3:55 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by lance4648

I hope you don't mind me responding. Personally, I consider anyone who loves God with all their heart and soul to be a Christian regardless if they go to an Assemblies of God or Catholic church. I also believe all churches are full of people who are going thru the motions.
A good indicator is how someone behaves out in the real world when a priest, pastor or church congregation isn't watching.

Nope, don't mind at all. Very well said, thanks! You show a lot of love. Your siggy doesn't say if you are a Pentecostal. Now, I'm anxiously waiting for the OP's answer. I love getting educated.

lance4648 · #**384** Yesterday, 4:28 pm

I grew up in the Assemblies of God church but started going to a Baptist Church when I moved to Colorado. I consider myself Pentecostal but usually just say Christian.
When choosing a church I tend to go by the people in the church and not the name on the door. When people love God, a church should be a place of spiratural renewal. Unfortunately, too many churches (regardless of denomination) are spiraturally dead and don't even know it. I went to church for years and learned what was expected and how to behave. It's only been recently that I realized that I knew who God was but I didn't "know" him.
I got on this site to learn more about the Catholic Church but also to fellowship with other Christians. I hate when the conversation takes an us vs them attitude. I'm proud to call you my Christian brothers and sisters and pray that y'all feel the same way.

ltwin · #**385** Yesterday, 4:49 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by journey00

Hi Itwin!! I think this is a great idea, thanks for starting this! I have questions:

1. This is going to be a lot of work, are you responding to all these questions by yourself?

4Squarebaby answered some questions. There have also been a few participants in the Catholic Charismatic Renewal that have regularly offered their unique perspective on some issues.

Quote:

Originally Posted by journey00

2. I see you had over a 1,000 posts before you began this neat thread. What events lead you to be part of a Catholic forum?

I just wanted to understand Catholicism. I wanted to hear everyday Catholics talk about their faith and just get a feel for it. Then I started reading questions about Pentecostalism occasionally, and I thought I could contribute to those discussions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by journey00

3. Did you join thinking you may find holes in Catholicism, thus disproving Catholicism?

No. I think it bad taste to come to a Catholic forum with the aim of disproving Catholicism. That being said, I've noticed that talking about points of disagreements and agreements with Catholics is an exercise for me to really discover and understand why Pentecostals and evangelicals believe what they believe and why they believe it. If you only talk to other Pentecostals or evangelicals, these questions often never come up because you will be starting from the same assumptions and speaking the same language. When you start from different assumptions and you use a different language, it gives you a reason to understand your own beliefs better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by journey00

4. Do Pentecostals believe that Catholics are Christian?

Pentecostals believe that the Church is made up of all born again believers. We would say that there are born again Christians in the Catholic Church, but we would not say that all Catholics are born again. This is the same thing we would say about the Pentecostal or the Baptist church. Some Pentecostals are born again, but certainly there are people who claim to be Pentecostal that are not born again. Jesus said that the wheat and the weeds would grow together (Matthew 13:24-30).

And you do have an older generation of Pentecostals that are highly suspicious of the Catholic Church and may even engage in such name calling as the "Whore of Babylon." However, most Pentecostals today are not antagonistic toward Catholics, but they probably don't understand them very much.

**grannymh** · #**386** Yesterday, 8:02 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltwin

OK, so maybe we don't believe the same things.

Let me explain the Pentecostal position more fully and then I'd like to hear the Catholic position in fuller detail.

Please accept my sincere apology for procrastinating.

Quote:

We believe that sin is both a condition and an act.

Here is where there is a major difference between the Pentecostal position and Catholicism. We believe that there are two separate sins, personal and original.

Quote:

We believe that scripture shows that the descendants of Adam are born into a sin cursed nature (Romans 5:12-21; Psalm 51:5). This is the sinful condition.

Catholicism, like other Christian religions, believes in the spiritual dignity of the human person because we are created in the image of God. It is because of this dignity and value in the sight of God, that God so loved the world.... Romans 5: 12 -21 is an affirmation of John 3:16.

Psalm 51 begins with a plea for the mercy of God Who is goodness in the greatness of compassion. In verse 7 there is the recognition that sin is everywhere so that even birth takes place in the environment of personal sin. Still, the author prays, albeit in a vague way, for his soul, not his actions, to return to God."A clean heart create for me," begs the author, "and a steadfast spirit renew within me." Psalm 51:12. His prayer is answered in Romans 5: 12-21

In its section on the definition of sin, the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition, paragraph 1850 refers both to Psalm 51 and Genesis, chapter 3. Mankind continues to sin personally throughout history; yet, these sins reflect the Original Sin of Adam who freely chose Satan's temptation to become like gods knowing all things. What else is there besides good and evil?

The Original Sin of Adam was primarily disobedience of the obvious "condition" that in order for the creature Adam to remain in the Creator's friendship, he had to freely live in submission (through obedience) to his Creator. St. Paul knew and taught about the necessity of Adam's obedience. "For just as through the disobedience of one person, the many were made sinners, so through the obedience of one (Jesus Christ), the many will be made righteous." Romans 5: 19. Here, St. Paul makes sure that in this instance he is not talking about the accumulated sins of mankind, he is definitively talking about one person.

St. Paul continues his theme of one man and one Jesus in 1 Corinthians 15: 21-22. This time he names that one man.

"For since death came through a human being, the resurrection of the dead came also through a human being. For just as in Adam all die, so too in Christ shall all be brought to life,"

I am not sure if I can properly explain what is happening. As one can tell from reading the above, Christians look to similar Scripture passages in order to understand the teachings handed down to the present day. For Catholics, understanding Original Sin is key to understanding the Divine Mystery of Christ.
When Christ is recognized as being Divine then Chapter six, Gospel of John, is understandable and so recognized as the Catholic Sacrament of the Eucharist.

There was a time in a high school class when we traced the paths of the main Reformers. I remember being "in love" with certain individuals. Tonight, I no longer remember the names of these individuals or how the differences between these men came about. I simply know that today there are differences in the way certain Scripture verses are interpreted and acted upon.

The above is just the beginning of Catholicism's theology position.

Comments?

jerry_joseph · #**387** Yesterday, 8:51 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltwin

No, it is not against my faith. Pentecostals do not deny the spiritual presence of Christ in Holy Communion. I refer you to post 50 page 4 and post 281 page 19 of this thread, which touch on this topic. I also cite a rather old article from the Pentecostal Evangel of July 12, 1919, "The Lord's Supper," p. 12:

Partakers of His Nature. Jesus took the unleavend bread----for they never used leavened bread at the Passover----and blessed and break it and said, "Take, eat, this is My body." As we come to the communion table, behind the symbol and the sign, we are to see our precious Savior and to appropriate and partake of Him. It is His desire to communicate Himself to us, and as we partake in faith, discerning Him whilst we feed, we receive life for our spirits, souls, and bodies.

God's Medicine. We were at a meeting at one time when a sister arose and told of a vision she had had three times repeated to her. She saw a communion table with the bread and the wine laid upon it, and the Lord appeared to her and said, "This is My medicine for My children." He told her that the reason that so many were weak and sickly was because they did not apprehend this provision for their bodies. Yes, at this feast we can partake of Christ, and He is alI we need for our bodies as well as for our spirits and our souls. Andrew Murray once wrote, "He gives Himself to me to be the food, the joy, the living power in my soul. O blessed heavenly giving of eternal love! Jesus gives me His own body: Jesus gives me Himself." . . . .

. . . . Jesus took the cup and gave thanks----a second giving of thanks----and gave to the disciples, saying, "This is My blood of the new testament which is shed for many for the remission of sins." The first testament or covenant was ratified by blood, and Moses not only sprinkled the book but all the people, Jer. 31: 31-34 gives us this new and better testament or covenant of which Jesus is the mediator, a covenant that promises us that the Lord will write Hiis law in our minds and hearts, that He will be our God and we shall be His people, that He will forgive our iniquities and remember our sins no more. Jesus' blood was the "better sacrifice" that ratifies the new covenant, and it is blessed to be sprinkled with this precious flow and to know that all our sins are remitted, never to be remembered against us again.

The Blood of the Grapes. The blood of beasts before Jesus came prefigured the atonement, the blood of grapes now shows it forth. Jesus is the true Vine, and just as the blood of the grapes represents the very life of the vine, so Jesus at Calvary gave His very life blood for us. Because of the shedding of His blood we can now partake of His life. The blood was shed for the many for the remission of sins. Praise God for the limitlessness of the atonement of Christ. It Is for "whosoever will." There is no limit to the preciousness and power of the blood of Christ.

Continued in next post

So you believe that Eucharist is body of Jesus.. Thanks

ltwin · #**388** Yesterday, 8:55 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry_joseph

So you believe that Eucharist is body of Jesus.. Thanks

In a spiritual sense, we do. As I said in another post on this thread, Pentecostals are on the spectrum between Zwinglian's memorial view and Calvin's spiritual presence view. Pentecostals that have been heavily influenced by certain types of evangelical theology, such as Baptist, may subscribe to a more symbolic, memorial view.

It's hard to explain because many of the early Pentecostals fervently denied ideas such as Transubstantiation and Consubstantiation. However, the way they spoke of the Lord's Supper was in very mystical and ambiguous ways. It was as if they were not quite sure how to explain the presence of Christ in the Lord's Supper, and they were grasping at an explanation. It is a mystery to put it simply.

One thing is certain, Pentecostals believe in the manifest presence of God. This is not limited to the Lord's Supper, but Christ is certainly present in a dynamic way through the Holy Spirit when we partake in Holy Communion.

As J. Roswell Flower wrote (which I cite in a post above), "The Lord Jesus is brought very near in the observance of the Lord’s Supper"

jerry_joseph · #**389** Yesterday, 9:03 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltwin

I already responded to this in post 375 page 25. But I wanted to give you more writings from Pentecostals over the years that touch on this question. D.W. Kerr, “The Message of the Sacrament.” The Weekly Evangel (28 October 1916), p. 4:

Faith can grasp mysteries that are unexplainable. Faith enters into a realm far beyond the sphere of understanding, and can extract the good and joy out of what soars high above our reasonings. We have no need to preach a doctrine of consubstantiation nor of transubstantiation; we just receive Jesus ’words and act on them. "Whoso eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood, hath everlasting life."

William A. Cox, “The Spiritual Import of the Lord’s Supper.” The Weekly Evangel (May 4, 1918), p. 8:

It (the Lord’s Supper) is not an empty service, it does not mean simply being served with a little bread and wine on the first Sunday of the month— it is a means of fellowship with God, through Jesus, by the Spirit, and we have a right to come to it expecting God to meet us. Indeed we have a right to expect to draw so near to God that whatever our need may be at that moment, whether spiritual or physical, He will supply it. . . . when we eat of the divine body of the Lord Jesus, the living Bread which came down from heaven. . . He quickens the spiritual man; He revives the physical; He heals our diseases, and gives us strength to live by. By eating Jesus, the Bread of life, we have life in our physical bodies. . . . if we eat the flesh of Jesus, and drink His blood, we shall live by Him. So when you want to be healed, just take a great big meal of Jesus.

Cecil B. Knight, “Communion: A Sign and a Seal.” Church of God Evangel (22 March 1971), p. 16-17:

There is deep spiritual meaning in the Lord’s Supper. The participant does not merely look at the symbols; he receives spiritual food. Just as the bread and the fruit of the vine will nourish and invigorate the body of man, so Christ, through Communion, sustains and quickens the soul. When a Christian truly worships Christ in the Lord’s Supper, he is ministered to by the Holy Spirit, thereby receiving strength and a deep abiding peace.

J. Roswell Flower, “The Lord’s Supper.” Word and Witness (August 1915), p. 5:

The Lord Jesus is brought very near in the observance of the Lord’s Supper. The redemptive work for the body is often attested to, as the communicants partake in faith, drinking His blood, and eating His flesh, the Lord healing them of sicknesses and delivering them of infirmities. Praise His precious name forever.

Sorry, bible clearly tells that those who eat's body and drinks the blood of Jesus have everlasting life.. During his last supper he gave bread to his disciples after blessing it and told , This is my body , eat it. And took vine and blessed it and told , this is my blood. It is clearly mentioned that it is my body and blood and not it represents my body and blood.

jerry_joseph · #**390** Yesterday, 9:35 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltwin

Continuation of previous post

We believe that they should be confessed to God directly in prayer because he is the one who forgives sin. We are told in Holy Scripture "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9). We believe that when we have harmed others, we should make confession both to God in prayer and to the person or people wronged.

This is an authority given to the entire church. All believers have this authority. Part of this authority relates to church discipline. Another part of this authority relates to the prayers of believers as they relate to the remission of the temporal consequences of sin. James 5:13-20,

You can see in bible , people confessing to Apostles , Acts 19:18 "Many of those who believed now came and openly confessed what they had done.". Why they confessed before apostles .?. Why didn't they prayed directly to God for the forgiveness of Sin?.

ask a Pentecostal

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26b Re: Ask a Pentecostal

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